Mother Answers on Physical Consciousness - II
Mother, what is the difference between a symbolic dream
and a vision?
Usually one has a vision when one is not asleep, when
one is awake. When one is awake and enters within oneselfwhether
in meditation or concentrationone has visions. Or
at night you can't sleep... remain stretched out, remain
quiet, don't sleep and you may have visions.
come when one is asleep, that is, when one has no longer
the waking consciousness; whereas in vision one is in
the waking consciousness, but one quietens or immobilises
it, and it is another more inner consciousness which awakens;
yet one is not asleep, the body is not asleep, it is just
can have visions even while remaining active. Some people
have visions even amidst activity. Vision is another plane
of perception which awakes. It is the senses in the mind
or vital or physical which wake up and manage to pass
their experiences to the outer consciousness. It is as
though one had another pair of eyes behind these, eyes
which could see in the vital instead of seeing in the
physical. And this is always there. Only, as one is concentrated
on the most material life, one doesn't notice it. But
some children have the two conjointly, they see even physically
all kinds of things which are not physical. Usually they
are told that they are saying stupid things; so they stop
speaking about them. But they don't see just this, only
physically, they see other things behind. One can have
visions with closed eyes, one can have visions with open
eyes; while when dreaming one is always asleep.
Any other questions?
can we distinguish between a symbolic dream and other
each one it is different; but it is a question of the
impression one has. Usually the symbolic dream is much
clearer, more precise, more coordinated, and carries with
it a kind of consciousness of something which is true...
I don't know... one remembers it better, it is not distorted
in the remembrance.
then, that's all?
Mother, there's a question of Jyotindra's.
Ah! What does he want to know, that child?
He wanted to know: when one is in
much pain or is very irritated, how can one sleep peacefully?
indeed needs a certain yogic power. The best wayand
this one is absoluteis to go out of one's body.
the body is in pain, when one has fever or is ill, you
see, or the body is very ill, the only thing to do is
to come out of it, to bring out one's vital being. And
then, if one is a yogi and knows, one rises just aboveso
as to see his body; the vital being, if it has come out
in a fairly material form, can see the body; one sees
his own physical body, and then at that moment, with the
consciousness one has and the force one has, one can direct
the rays of these forces on the place in the body which
is ill. But this of course is the peak, it is the surest
way of curing oneself; and if one has the power and the
knowledge, it is infallible.
can cure oneself of anything whatever in a very short
time. Only, all this means a great practice, a training
of the being. It does not come all at once, you see. But
in fact when the pain is intolerable and people faint,
they do this instinctively. To faint is to go out of one's
body. So some people, who are not too closely tied to
their body, when something goes wrong, becomes too painful
or is not all right, they faint.
great a pain makes you faint away, that is, you go out
of your body, you really go out and leave the body very
inert; and provided someone is there who has enough knowledge
not to shake you like this (gesture) to wake you
up, it is a means of escape from suffering. Of course,
if you have beside you someone who is panic-stricken and
sprinkles cold water on your head or shakes you, then
the result can be disastrous, but otherwise one can...
And little by little, naturally, as there is no longer
any consciousness there to record the suffering, it becomes
calm, and in almost every case the body becomes motionless
enough to be able to rest even in spite of the suffering.
It doesn't feel it at all any longer. This is the best
are minor methods and they have smaller results; they
are not very easy either, that is, the knowledge of the
power to cut the connection between the suffering part
and the recording brain. One cuts the connection, then
the brain does not register. That's what one does, what
the doctors do with anaesthetics. They cut the connection
of the nerves between the spot that's ill and the brain;
so the brain no longer perceives anything or it is reduced
to a minimum. And it always comes back to the same thing,
one way or another; and all this calls for an occult power
or a training. Some people have it spontaneously; there
are not many of thesevery few. But obviously, without
going so far, there is one thing that one can try to do:
it is not to concentrate on one's pain, to turn the attention
away as much as possible, not think at all of one's pain,
think as little as possible and above all not be concentrated
on it, not to pay attention"Oh, I'm in pain",
then it becomes a little worse; "Oh, I'm in still
greater pain", then it becomes still worse, like
that, because one is concentrated on it; and this is the
mistake one always makes: to think, be there, attentive,
awaiting the sign of pain; then naturally it comes, it
comes increased by the concentration of the attention
given to it. That is why, when one is not well the best
thing to do is to read or have something read, you see;
it depends on the condition one is in. But if one can
turn one's attention away, one no longer suffers.
And so, that's all?
Mother, do we need to dream?
Do we what?...
... need to dream?...
Need to dream! But it's not a question of need, my child,
one always dreams.
But why do we dream?
do you walk on your feet, with the head in the air, and
why do you eat and sleep? It is like that. There is no
why about it. There is no why, it is part of the general
are not something imposed upon you like that, artificially.
It is not as when you are sent to school to learn something,
not like that. They are a part of your normal working,
that is, usually it is the head, the brain which goes
on working. Sometimes, when one is in slightly higher
states, it is an inner being that enters into activity,
goes to its own domain and lives there its own life. But
all these things are not artificially organised for some
reason or other. They are a part of the body's functioning.
Dreams are as natural as the activities of the day; and
then in a dream one finds out more or less that one understands
nothing about it, but in life it's exactly the same thing
becauseno matter what happensyou are always
asking yourself hundreds of questions to know why, how
and what it is that's happened. You know nothing about
it. Only, you are in the habit of its being like that.
That's all. No questions?
have a question still.
Sweet Mother, when one sleeps the
consciousness is different from the waking consciousness...
Yes, and so "Why?"(Laughter)
How is it different?
you have never noticed that it is different? For example,
your physical consciousness or your subtle physical consciousness,
your vital consciousness or the consciousness of your
higher or lower vital, your psychic consciousness, your
mental consciousness, each one is completely different!
So when you sleep you have one consciousness, and when
you are awake you have another. In your waking state you
look at things projected outside you, in your sleep state
you see them interiorised. So it is as though in one case
you were pushed altogether outside yourself, in front,
and in the other it is as though you were looking at yourself
in an inner mirror.
understand? Not very well!
Well, it's something one must learn to distinguish, one's
states of consciousness, because otherwise one lives in
a perpetual confusion.
fact, it is the first step on the path, it is the beginning
of the thread, if one doesn't hold on to the end of the
thread, one is lost on the way. This is only to hold the
end of the thread.
Mother, when one sees oneself dead in a dream, what does
Ah! I have already been asked this several times. It depends
on the context.
can mean that one has made enough progress to get rid
totally of an old way of being which has no longer any
reason for existing. This, I think, is the most frequent
case. Otherwise it depends absolutely on the context,
that is, the circumstances surrounding the dream.
is... one sees himself dead... How does he see himself
dead? Does he simply see the inert body or himself already
dead, or does he take for dead what is not dead?
see, if you leave your bodyby going out of the body
as I explained a while agoif you have gone out materially
enough, in a very material vital, well, the body which
is lying on the bed seems absolutely dead, but it is not
dead for all that. But if you look at it or see it while
you are outside and you don't know, it seems absolutely
dead, it is in a cataleptic state. Then if you know what
is necessary and what you ought to do it is very easy;
but if you don't know and the imagination starts roaming,
then you open the door to fear and anything may happen.
in fact, I don't think that once in a million times it
is a premonitory dream. I think it much more likely that
it is a fragment of the being which has stopped being
useful and so disappears; so the fragment takes the form
of the whole and one sees himself dead because this fragment
has stopped existing in him. This is the most frequent
and the most logical instance.
one may see not a death but, for example, an accident
or an assassination or things like that... Then it is
a very real violent dream, you know, and this may mean
that one is attacked by bad forces sent by someone with
a precise purpose. Then one has only to strike hard and
Mother, sometimes when one is asleep, he knows that he
is asleep but he can't open his eyes. Why?
happens when one has gone out of his body, and one must
not force things, one must quite simply, slowly, concentrate
his consciousness in his body and wait a while for the
fusion to be made normally; one must not force things.
the eyes are a little open and one can also see things...
one can't move!
means that only a fragment of the consciousness has come
back, not enough to bring back the full movement in the
body. You must not shake yourself, because you risk losing
a bit of yourself. You must remain quite still and concentrate
slowly, slowly, on your body; it can take a minute or
two at the most.
can one lose?
at all, something that has gone out, you see. It's because
one part of the being has gone out; so if you shake yourself,
it doesn't have the time to get back. Why, there's someone
behind you (Nolini) who has had an experience of
this kindsomeone startled him out of his sleep,
and when he came back he had truly the feeling that something
was missing. Isn't that so? (Mother turns to Nolini)
I told him to concentrate quietly; it came back. Only,
if one is afraid it can become complicated, you see.
one must never startle anyone out of his sleep because
he must have time to get back into his body. It is not
good, for instance, when getting up to jump out of bedhop!
You must remain quiet for a while, like this (gesture),
as though you were bringing yourself back into yourself,
like that, quietly... quietly. When you are quite calm,
when you feel that everything is there, then you get up
and it is over. But you must never jump out of bed abruptly,
it is not good. Besides, sometimes it happens that those
who wake up abruptly and jump out of bed feel giddy and
risk falling. You must always make a movement like this
(gesture), as though you were gathering your consciousness
or all kinds of things which may be gathered in one's
body; you remain very quiet for a few seconds of assimilation
and when it is done properly, you get up quietly, composedly.
What else? Nothing?
So it is finished!
- The Mother